[00:00:01] Speaker A: I'm Lila Ree.
[00:00:02] Speaker B: And I'm Nick B.
[00:00:03] Speaker A: Listen, we're just two single girls from the city of roses discussing all things love, lust and perception.
[00:00:09] Speaker B: And roses are a symbol of all things beautiful about love.
[00:00:12] Speaker A: But as you know, love can get a little dirty. So we're here to talk about it.
[00:00:16] Speaker B: Dirty Roses podcast starts now.
[00:00:18] Speaker A: Hey, I'm Lila Ree.
[00:00:20] Speaker B: And I'm Nick B.
[00:00:21] Speaker A: And welcome to Dirty Roses Podcast. We are here on our season five of Doing all the things us. Yes, I had no other words, but today we are joined by more podcast, more podcasters.
[00:00:38] Speaker B: That has been the theme of our season.
[00:00:39] Speaker A: I absolutely love this. For us, I think this season has been our season of networking and connecting with other podcast professionals. And we met this amazing couple at the Empowered Podcast Festival, which you've heard.
[00:00:52] Speaker B: Us mention many times before.
[00:00:55] Speaker A: But they were. Well, we went to a session with one of them and his beautiful wife was there in the audience being supportive, but also contributing to the amazing conversations before after giving her little wifey comments during this session. So. But it was an amazing interaction. The session was great. She was amazing. Them together are amazing. But we are joined by this power podcast couple, this power business couple, this power married couple. Say more power parents. Just all of that. The goddamn power people.
We are joined by the Lawsons, Mr. Dominic Lawson and Kenda Lawson. Now, Dominic is the host of Black is America podcast and Kenda is the host of the B Word. The both episodes or both podcasts have made me cry in the past couple days. And I don't know if it's because I'm emotional and I use air quotes this time of month, but no, seriously, the Black is America podcast discusses like unknown or untalked about black historical figures and tells their stories with this amazing audiobook, podcast style sound engineer to perfection type podcast.
[00:02:19] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:02:20] Speaker A: And then she comes in with this super relatable to black women, probably women in just general, but really black women, about all the things that we are that can be taken negatively, but make us who we are and how we deal with that in society, in our personal, professional lives, everything. And I literally was like, she's telling my story.
[00:02:44] Speaker C: So.
[00:02:45] Speaker A: So you guys, welcome. Thank you so much for joining us today. We are excited to have you.
[00:02:50] Speaker C: Thank you so much for having us.
[00:02:52] Speaker D: Yeah, thank you. And for that introduction. I wish I had like a tenth of that power.
[00:02:57] Speaker A: Listen, y'all got it.
So we are talking today about winning together. Clearly they both do podcasts. They have their own individual podcasts, but they do work closely together. They Executive produce. They write for each other. They do the sound engineering for each other. They also have their own business. The owls.
Tell me again, because I keep is Ask our solutions, or is it Owls Education Company? Okay. And so you guys discuss education pieces and you contribute to people who are in education as well as that are like the. The DEI type stuff.
[00:03:40] Speaker D: We do a lot of training, so basically. Or it's traditional schools, but as well as, like, learning any, like, businesses and that sort of thing have learning needs. So we try to, you know, make those professional developments or, you know, things that you have to do at work a lot less boring, more engaging and something that, you know, you take away and you feel empowered. So. Right.
[00:04:04] Speaker B: So then with all the projects that you guys have going on individually and separately, how do you guys not get tired of each other? You. You're so intertwined with everything. I think that's going to be something I'm most interested in, understanding the dynamics of balancing personal life and work life.
[00:04:25] Speaker C: Yeah, you know, it's interesting and we talk about this all the time. Like, sometimes when we're like, in the mode of work, we can be sitting right next to each other, but in two totally different worlds. Right. And believe it or not, that's sometimes a gift and a curse. Right. You know, because it's one of those things where maybe we're not cohesive on one aspect or another and stuff like that. So those are definitely things we have to work through. But it, it works for the most part. It really does.
[00:04:55] Speaker A: So when you guys are doing the podcast and the other things together, how do you actually do the work? Do you do it independently, come together to put everything together, or do you actually work hands on, in the moment together?
[00:05:10] Speaker D: We. There are times when all of those things are true. You know, if you asked me, you know, how do we not get sick of each other? I think we do like, we do, but we mastered the art of, like, going to our separate corners. You know, like, we have different spaces at home that, you know, he sort of stakes out and I'll be in my space.
Even in the video games. Yeah, that's if we're taking a break, we take breaks separately. If we're at the office, there's different spaces. So when we have to come together, we come together. And that sort of limits that time where it's like we're directly, you know, breathing down each other's necks and so, you know, that sort of thing. And so it's like, I think we just mastered the art of going to our Separate corners. And then whatever the work is, just knowing what your wheelhouse is like. There are times where, you know, I'm a little opinionated and you know, I'll definitely want to be like, like, we sure about that part? But I understand that like editing is his wheelhouse. And so although we have to edit together because sometimes he might have questions about like, what did I intended there or something like that, or force me to go re record things when he feels like they're not perfect.
[00:06:24] Speaker A: How does that make you feel?
[00:06:26] Speaker D: I'm a perfectionist too. So I actually I. I like okay. I like feedback. So it's like, okay, yeah, that's, that's not a problem. And I think it's a little different the other way. When I'm like, I'm listening to his episode and I'm like, hey, yeah, I don't think that's the word you meant.
[00:06:41] Speaker A: And he's just like, I said what I said.
[00:06:47] Speaker C: Well, it's more so like I like. It's kind of like there's aspects of like, Ah, damn it, now I gotta go re record this part. So it's like there's parts of that too. Like I said, we're kind of alphas married together. So it's kind of like that. That kind of happens from time to time.
[00:07:01] Speaker B: And how did you two actually meet? Was it a work related meeting or was it casual?
[00:07:07] Speaker C: Well, we've known each other since we were kids. Oh, but this isn't that. That. Star crossed lovers. Love at first sight.
[00:07:15] Speaker B: You guys weren't high school sweethearts?
[00:07:17] Speaker D: No.
[00:07:17] Speaker C: God no. No.
[00:07:20] Speaker D: I don't know. I think weirdly we might have worked some of this out as, as like kids.
He's like captain everything. We were both in ROTC together. For example. This. We had to kind of like work closely together and we weren't just like in each other's orbit. And so he's. He's pretty much like the. The what? The rifle team captain, Rifle team captain.
[00:07:41] Speaker C: Color guard commander captain. Drill team captain.
[00:07:45] Speaker B: Like, okay, come through, Captain.
[00:07:47] Speaker C: Except in this one area, which I'm pretty sure she's going to tell the story now, which is.
[00:07:51] Speaker D: I cannot tell.
[00:07:53] Speaker A: No, you gotta tell the story now.
[00:07:55] Speaker B: I want to know the story.
[00:07:57] Speaker D: So I was the captain of the land navigation team and it's like, it's a weirdly sort of like thinking or either like problem solving, things like that. So instead of him being the captain, they put him on my team. And so. Which worked out fine at first because I'm like, all right, Cool. He's. I. I'm taking stock of everybody that's on the team. I'm like, all right. Dominic's really athletic and kind of has, like, a real strong person, you know, leadership and, you know, stubborn quality. So he's gonna. He's gonna be the scout, right? And I sort of. I just. I think all this out, and I got everything covered, but we've never done this. Like, we went to, like, an inner city high school, and, yeah, they did not invest money in our program. I think we had, like, a lesson or two at the beginning of the year about, like, looking at, you know, topograph, like, maps and. Maps and stuff like that and features, whatever, and try and get yourself oriented. And then, like, at the end of the year, they're like, hey, you know, we're gonna drop you guys in the middle of the woods, and you gotta find your. Your way out. And so, Kenda, we think you can do this. And it's like, you know, like, okay, so, you know, we're in the middle of the woods, and I'm definitely doing it wrong. And I have. I. I do that sometimes. Like, I do it wrong, but it gets done. And I think a lot. You know, you said about black women, I think a lot of black women, we have that right. It's like, yeah, I didn't have any training. This probably. This is not the official way. This is done. But we were getting it done so much so that we came in. We were. We ended up coming out just ahead of a place that we were supposed to hit. So we were a little. I missed. I miscalculated just a little bit. And we come out ahead of it, and the people were, like, shocked. They were like, westwood, what are y'all doing here? It's like, man, you guys are actually right behind White Station, which is this perennial. Like, they, you know, put money into their program.
[00:09:45] Speaker A: It sounds like it.
That was intentional.
[00:09:52] Speaker D: So there. So the people were excited because they were like, nobody's ever beat them before. So they were like, run. Like, go back. You know, go back and hit that checkpoint or whatever. But you guys are like, you're in this. And so. But it. We had to. We had to deal with some. You know, there was some insubordination at certain points, because I think this is a part of our personalities that, you know, it does become, like, a sticking point when we. When we work together, because Dominic is very, like. He's very organized. He's very by the book. And, you know, this is what it is. And I Remember reading in the manual and that sort of thing? And I'm just like, he's head of.
[00:10:27] Speaker B: Policy and procedure, basically, pretty much.
[00:10:29] Speaker D: And I'm like, sergeant at arms. You know, we're just gonna run northwest and see what happens.
[00:10:39] Speaker C: Makes me itch.
[00:10:40] Speaker D: I know.
Yeah, he hates it. But. So we're in the middle of the woods, and we're having this thing, and it's like, all right, I think. I think. And this is what led us to come out at that point, but we had to run up this massive heel and understanding. Like, not everybody in the group was really athletic and that Dominic was the scout. So he's like, I think we need to, you know, just stay on the path and go this way. And so, yeah, he had this moment where it was like, I don't. I forget what that movie is. Like, who's coming with me? Yeah, the Jerry Maguire moment where he's like, you know, she doesn't know what she's doing. And, like, I'm just gonna take. I'm gonna. You know, I'm gonna take point here and who's coming with me? And it was just like, everybody in the group was like, yeah, nobody came with me.
[00:11:27] Speaker A: Oh, you had your little box, and you're walking to the flag by yourself. Like, I'm just gonna go capture this by myself.
[00:11:34] Speaker D: No, he stayed. And so how.
[00:11:36] Speaker A: Good.
[00:11:37] Speaker D: Yeah, so I think after. After they were like, listen, if I'm be lost in the woods, yeah, I think I'm gonna. I think I'm gonna stick with Kenda.
[00:11:46] Speaker C: And then. So. Yeah, well, so Kenda, like, is like. Like, top of our class salutatorian. Like, so everybody knows her as super intelligent, super smart, super analytical, and this, that, and the other. So that's why it was easy. Like, yeah, we gonna go with her, bro. Like, you ain't like, you cool, but, like, we gonna go with her, bro.
[00:12:06] Speaker A: So that's so funny. So after this engagement with Yalls interactions on the rotc, you guys separated and Winch lived your own lives and then returned together, or.
[00:12:21] Speaker D: That's the. That's the gist of it. I think after that, we. We always had these kind of little power struggles, that sort of thing, and I said, so I think it was one of those things where, you know, we're high schoolers, so we don't realize we like each other, but we hate each other. And so we go our separate ways, and I end up in Houston, and his sister is in Houston. You know, he sends me. You know, he slides into the DMs okay.
My MySpace.
[00:12:48] Speaker B: He was trying to be your top five.
[00:12:53] Speaker D: Well, he's basically like, you know, my little sister's there, and I know, you know, we don't really get along and that sort of thing where you, you know.
[00:13:01] Speaker C: Right.
[00:13:02] Speaker D: We may be pissed or something in the stairwell.
There's a couple of times last night, it's like a. It was a weird kind of dislike.
[00:13:10] Speaker C: Well, I don't exactly love hate, but it's like, that's probably the best way to kind of describe it, if you will.
[00:13:15] Speaker A: A dislike. Cordiality.
[00:13:17] Speaker C: There you go. There you go.
[00:13:20] Speaker A: So when did you guys actually end up coming back together and deciding we're going to try this love hate thing in a relationship?
[00:13:31] Speaker D: I just, I guess slowly, like, so, you know, he reached out to me. He was like, hey, I know we don't really get along, but could you look after my sister? His sister's, like, super cool, like, even to this day. So it's just like, no problem. And it's been, I don't know, close to 10 years at that point. So I. I don't know. I think I. I put on Facebook, I had just gotten Facebook, that I was, like, coming back to Memphis and, you know, just want to see what's up with everybody. And he responded, and I was like.
[00:13:57] Speaker A: Okay, of all people to respond.
[00:14:03] Speaker D: I took my sister, if you get what I'm saying.
But after we watched the movie, we. We sat for, like, hours and we started, you know, talking. And then I think I had to go back home the next day or something like that. And he sent me this really nice test text message, just saying, like, I think I was going to. I was going to. He was going Texas.
[00:14:22] Speaker C: He was going to Texas, and I was going north. But we were connected on the same interstate going the opposite direction or something.
[00:14:29] Speaker B: Now let's meet at exit 72.
[00:14:32] Speaker A: That's so cute.
Story to be turned into one of those audio books that y'all be doing.
[00:14:42] Speaker D: Right? So he's like. He sent me the text messages. Like, I. I love the thought that we're connected by i55. And I was like, that's super sweet. So slowly, over the course of, like, maybe the next year or so, yeah, we just kind of started talking and.
[00:14:57] Speaker A: How long have y'all been together and married?
[00:14:59] Speaker C: We have been married for 11 years now, but we've been together for. What Was the date?
2011.
Since 2011.
[00:15:12] Speaker A: Oh, wow. So 23 years.
[00:15:15] Speaker D: No, wait, no, I can't count.
[00:15:20] Speaker B: It's been a long day.
[00:15:25] Speaker A: Gotcha I heard 2001.
[00:15:26] Speaker B: I know. I know you did.
[00:15:28] Speaker C: Fair enough.
[00:15:28] Speaker D: So then, with all these years, don't mess with us. We're old. You see, we both had to think about it.
[00:15:35] Speaker A: See, we in this together, with all.
[00:15:39] Speaker B: These years of experience being together and learning each other and working so closely together, how do you two manage disagreements in your relationship and also in your professional relationship?
[00:15:53] Speaker C: Well, I think one of the things we try to remember is we don't think. You kind of mentioned the wheelhouse doctrine, if you will. Right. So the wheelhouse doctrine is basically like, who is the expert at this thing? Right. You know, the other one can provide input. This and the other. But we've already established, like, you are the expert at this thing. So whatever you decide we're going to do, I'm not going to provide input. This any other. But whatever Kendall decides to do, that's what we're going to do. There's no team sabotage. There's no I told you so. There's no. None of that. Like, that's what we're going to do. And it works vice versa. It works pretty much. So, you know, for the most part now, I mean, there's times where, like, I'll have, like, a miscommunication mode, like you said.
[00:16:37] Speaker A: What now?
[00:16:39] Speaker C: Something like that. But for the most part, that's kind of how it works, but also just understanding, like, what's the end goal here? Right. No, I. I think that's. That's super important. And again, it doesn't always work as perfectly as we want it to. Right. Like, there was a moment this week I was like, I don't know, man. Like, am I. I'm doing something wrong here or something like that. But I. I think it's just one of those things where, at the end of the day, this is my person, and I just have to remember that my person always has my best interest at heart. And even though it may come off as, like, you know, hurt my feelings, sometimes you check myself, like, maybe. Maybe I'm being a little bit too sensitive, or maybe I'm being a little bit, you know, insecure and how I feel about something. So sometimes a lot of that is like having to check myself as well.
[00:17:27] Speaker D: Right. I think, you know what he said about being goal oriented. We're both goal oriented. And I think it's important because I can say some stuff that, you know, it'll sound, like, terrible and it'll sound hurtful. Like, the idea that, like, this isn't.
This love isn't unconditional. Because that's not true. Right. There are conditions. And, you know, everybody has those. So I, you know, I. I'm kind of a realist and that sort of thing. So I. I think it's like, I'm gonna communicate with you if I feel like this is a problem, that sort of thing. And just understanding, like, if. If I'm doing that, it's like I'm in it, and I just wanna not perfect it. Because nothing is ever, you know, nothing's ever gonna be perfect. But just, you know, hey, this is the goal. And the goal that we keep constantly coming back to and reaffirming is that the goal is for us to make it. To stay together, to build a business, to make sure Zoe's okay. Like, we check in about those things. And so as long as we're both dedicated to the same goals, we can have, which we do. Different personalities, you know, like, I'm kind of oddly, you know, free, willing and that sort of thing. And more like, you know, that's her thing, believe it or not. Because I think people tend to, for whatever reason, think that I would be like, the most, like, passionate ones. But he's like, he. If. If there isn't disagreement, he's gonna, like, I gotta let the fire, like the flash of. Of heat kind of die down. And then usually it's like, all right, cool, we can calmly. We can discuss it.
[00:18:59] Speaker A: That is great. I love it. So you mentioned communication being a big piece of it. So what are some key strategies that you guys use to deal with communication issues or to keep communication good across the board?
[00:19:16] Speaker D: I think you have to, like, be comfortable having uncomfortable conversations. Like that first part, when you hear something, it's like, okay, if he comes and he's like, hey, I want to talk to you about something, it's like, immediately everybody's hackles go up, right? And it's just like, oh, oh, no. And then you get defensive and that sort of thing. So it's like. It's just pushing through that initial part of discomfort where the person says something, and it's like, oh, okay, well, let me consider that. And it's like, okay, yeah, some. There's. There's validity. There's like. There's a lot of that. That's right. And that sort of thing. But then there might be some of it that you need context for. Like, this is what I was intending, and that sort of thing. There's this great quote. We went through a leadership program. This guy said that we judge ourselves by our. Our intention, and we Judge other people by their actions. And. And it. That was really powerful. Right, because it's like, yeah, we just sort of see people do stuff and we make assumptions about, like, why they did it and what's behind it and, you know, motives and all that. And then sometimes it's just like, if you push through the discomfort of just asking the person directly, like, hey, when you said that, it. It hurt my feelings. And I wanted to know, well, you know, what were your intentions behind.
[00:20:32] Speaker B: That's a good question to ask.
[00:20:36] Speaker C: In addition to that, though, like, when I say, hey, we need to talk, I use. I've gotten better, like, saying like, hey, I need to talk to you. It ain't bad. Ain't nothing wrong. We're good. But it is a serious conversation. So it also. Setting those expectations help as well.
[00:20:51] Speaker B: That is important. I think that anytime someone hears the phrase we need to talk, we feel like we're getting pulled into the detention office or the principal's office, and it immediately feels like we've done something wrong or, I don't know, just that moment of uncertainty of, oh, God, what did I do?
So I'm glad that you preface. No, we're good. It ain't that serious. But this is serious. Let's talk about something. Don't trip.
[00:21:22] Speaker C: I think that. I think that's important. I. I really do. Because, I mean, you can get so bogged down with life and this and the other. Sometimes things gets lost. Like, I'll say something sometimes to Kenda and she'll take it one way. Oh, no, no, no, no, that's not what I meant.
[00:21:39] Speaker B: Abort, Abort.
[00:21:41] Speaker C: Like, you know, do not pass go or whatever. But like. But like, it's just keeping those lines of communication open and being honest when we do communicate. Like, listen, when you said this, this is how it made me feel some type of way. And being honest that, like, I know she's not going to. To beat me up, and I. And I have to reciprocate that as well.
[00:22:02] Speaker D: So.
[00:22:02] Speaker A: Yeah, because the thing.
[00:22:04] Speaker C: The thing is like, you know, my wife is also a. A debate champion, right? And an English. And so it's like, you know, I know I have to, like, tread lightly. Like, she gonna slice this argument left or right, but I know it's coming out of a place of love. You know what I mean? So it's. I know my person is going to, like, she's not out to get me.
[00:22:27] Speaker B: Are there any projects that the two of you refuse to work on together because you're like, nope, I know how you're going to be. And we do not mesh well on this.
[00:22:40] Speaker D: There's nothing like that because we just like, I'm a push through discomfort kind of person. It's just like, hey, listen, you don't have to like, like, I want him to like it. I want you to, you know, be enthused when I have a house project that I saw on Pinterest and, and I'm like, yeah, we can do make it and not pay money for it.
[00:23:04] Speaker B: Let's go get some two by fours.
[00:23:06] Speaker D: Yeah, exactly. Like, exactly.
[00:23:09] Speaker A: She's like, see this bookshelf behind us? We did that and did.
[00:23:16] Speaker D: Andy.
But I've learned that like he's not as enthusiastic about those types of projects that as I am. So it's not that I don't, I'm like, yeah, I refuse to, but I do limit his engagements, I do limit his role. And I'm like, listen, I, I legit cannot carry this bookshelf by myself. Like, I need to bring you in, I need to tag you in. But the rest of it, like, actually.
[00:23:40] Speaker C: You know that that is true. However, I, I think over the past couple of years I've tried to be better about like, you know, finding a place of enthusiasm, know, enthusiasm there, right? Because like, at the end of the day I know it's something that puts a smile on her face, right? Because I know for a lot of times I'm like, I just, I want it to be perfect. I don't want to, I don't want to screw this up for you. Right. I'm so concerned about that. And like we had a conversation recently where it's like, listen, if we do it together and we screw it up, then we screw it up, it's fine. And I think that took like a big load off of like, okay, let's lower the anxiety. If it screws up, we'll have a laugh about it and it'll be fine. So. So yeah, again, just having those conversations.
[00:24:23] Speaker D: You know, I think sometimes I get, and I do have that repetition and it's, it's somewhat earned about being a perfectionist. I said that earlier, but the truth is like, I want to perfect things. I don't expect them to be perfect, especially not in the beginning. So I think that's a hard thing sometimes for people to understand. It's like, we can succeed in a lot. But it doesn't mean I don't expect to fail. It just means I know that I'm going to push through the failure. I know that, oh, we can fix that or we can, you know, that sort of thing. So I think that was a thing that was really difficult based on the fact that, you know, he has perfectionistic tendencies as well, but he likes to get it right in the beginning. Like, I want the process to be the. The, you know, perfect and that sort of thing. And I'm like, you know.
[00:25:09] Speaker C: Yeah. Because, like, I'll be the person like, okay, let's make sure we set our tools properly. And we have everything in place. We have the safety goggles on.
[00:25:17] Speaker A: She's like, we're gonna figure out.
[00:25:19] Speaker B: Are either of you guys Virgos? Because I feel like you're describing me. Is anybody a Virgo?
[00:25:25] Speaker D: Actually, I'm the Virgo. I knew it.
[00:25:27] Speaker B: I knew it. I was like, that's me right there.
[00:25:30] Speaker D: Like that.
[00:25:32] Speaker A: Oh, gosh.
[00:25:32] Speaker D: Oh, my gosh. I'm like, so basically we have to spend an hour preparing for a. Before you can get started. Ten minutes like, oh, no, no, no, no, no, no. I'm like, listen, let's just get started.
Okay. Also, in fairness, and it's like, I don't know why. Literally, I'm thinking about putting IKEA stuff together. Are you thinking about that too?
[00:25:53] Speaker C: Yes.
[00:25:54] Speaker A: Oh, that's the worst.
[00:25:56] Speaker B: Where there's no instructions, just pictures.
[00:25:58] Speaker D: But I like puzzles.
Well, I. I love puzzles. So I'm just like, okay, I know we. We both know the pictures aren't really going to help us here. So I'm just like, I think this piece goes with here and, you know, and it usually works out.
[00:26:15] Speaker A: Wait, Dominic, what are you. What's your sign?
[00:26:17] Speaker C: I'm a Scorpio.
[00:26:19] Speaker A: Oh, so he's a Miles, like my son. My son's a Scorpio. Okay, I get it. This makes sense.
I like it. So speaking of kids, how do you guys. You have had one child or two?
[00:26:35] Speaker C: So I was married before.
[00:26:37] Speaker A: Okay. Okay.
[00:26:38] Speaker C: I was married before. So I had two of my ex wife. And then we have one together, Zoe.
[00:26:44] Speaker A: Okay, gotcha. So how do you guys exhibit healthy relationships, healthy work relationships, all the communication skills for your children to kind of build them up to be productive citizens and future good relationship holders?
[00:27:03] Speaker D: You know, that's one of the things, as a parent, you can never really know because it's like, obviously I'm going to share some tips here, but it's like, you never know if you're doing it right until, you know, hopefully, you know, she grows up and it's like, yeah, we did that.
So far it's going well. She's, you know, she's a middle schooler. And yeah, we don't get calls home every day and that sort of thing. So maybe, you know, maybe we're doing something right. Mostly it's just, you know, I think I ended up. I, I'm grateful that I think I ended up. I was supposed to be her mother.
My daughter requires a lot of patience and a lot of repetition. And in a lot of ways it has helped that I was a teacher and you know, and, and now she's right in the grade band. So it's, you know, it's kind of interesting where, you know, she's a, you know, she's a pre. These are the fun years and I expect them, you know, that sort of thing. And so, you know, and then her dad. Oh, so my daughter's a Taurus, since we're, we're clocking.
[00:28:04] Speaker B: Oh, I know a Taurus as well.
[00:28:06] Speaker D: All right. So, you know the, the Scorpio Taurus, like stubbornness, Very stubborn and always right.
[00:28:14] Speaker B: Little bossy, but in a cute way.
[00:28:18] Speaker D: Pretty much.
[00:28:19] Speaker B: Right.
[00:28:19] Speaker D: And so it's, it's more so I get to be the, you know, serve referee. I'm kind of, I'm kind of calm, you know, most of the time. So it's like, it's cool to see like, she. And I get to engage and I'll be like, hey, okay, Zoe, let's talk about what just happened. Like, this is, you know, the conversation. Were you thinking about, like, you tell me what you were feeling or you were thinking, and then I'll tell you how this could be perceived, that sort of thing. And then the conversation with them, with them is like, you know, it's fun.
It's fun. And it, but it's so, it's so weird too because, oh my gosh, he loves her to death and, and she doesn't. I don't think she realized she literally has him wrapped around her finger.
[00:28:57] Speaker A: Uh huh.
[00:28:59] Speaker B: He's like, yep, facts.
[00:29:00] Speaker D: He legitimately wants nothing else but for her to invite him to tea parties. And you know, all the rest of this is like, dude, it's just, it's not your lane.
[00:29:10] Speaker A: Please tell, please tell me you were the dad that put on the tutus and sat down with the pinkies up and the teacups.
[00:29:17] Speaker C: Oh, for sure.
[00:29:18] Speaker D: Oh, no, he's that man.
[00:29:20] Speaker C: Yeah, for sure.
[00:29:20] Speaker D: No, he's not that daughter.
[00:29:22] Speaker A: Okay.
He's like, I would have.
[00:29:26] Speaker D: He would have gladly. And it's. Sometimes he wanted. So he wants it so much. It's, it's, it's painful, but yeah, I'm.
[00:29:33] Speaker C: A little thirsty for my daughter's affection.
[00:29:35] Speaker D: That.
[00:29:35] Speaker B: That say, that's super cute.
[00:29:41] Speaker D: I'm gonna be your mom no matter what. It. I. I don't.
[00:29:46] Speaker A: It's so cute. When did you guys decide to do podcasting? And did you both decide at the same time that this was a venture you wanted to get into? Or did one start and then in support the other one was like, I kind of like that too.
[00:30:02] Speaker C: Well, it really started from a blog. I used to write a blog about business or whatever. Right. And so I was doing this blog for like a year, and then Kendall was like, you know, hey, have you thought about podcasts here? This thing about podcasts? And so I like, research for like a month or whatever and then just kind of dived into it. And it really just kind of started from there. I started November 1, 2016.
It's like recording episodes in my closet and. And stuff like that. Doing a few episodes here and there, and then once interview the co founder of Netflix. That's kind of when things just kind of really took off. Oh, nice there. And just kind of just grew the podcasting career. And then after a few years of doing it and doing all types of different styles and stuff like that, I was hired by a behavioral company to do it for them and stuff like that. So I was like, you know, they out here passing out checks for podcasts.
[00:30:59] Speaker A: Okay, pass them over here, please.
[00:31:02] Speaker C: Right. But as far as my wife getting into it and doing it herself, I think, you know, she had this idea of wanting to rebrand the B word, because when it comes to women, especially black women, you know, she wanted to, like, you know, change that narrative and kind of redefine it. And that's when she kind of got in the game as far as from a hosting side, because she was always doing it from, like, an executive producer side.
[00:31:27] Speaker D: Okay.
[00:31:27] Speaker C: From like, the startup life and Black is America and stuff like that. Funny story. She actually, when I was doing the startup life, she actually did an episode because I got sick and I couldn't talk. So she actually stepped in and did the episode for me because I wanted to have that consistency.
So, you know, a lot of cursing in that episode.
But from there, we really just, you know, kind of just went all in with it a little bit. But one of the things I've always been appreciative of Kenda is her seeing something in me that I don't see in myself. And she always thought that, like, I could be great at something like a podcasting or broadcasting or something like that, you know, because, you know, she's the one that bought the first microphone. She built the studio, like, because my wife. My wife's the Bob Villa of the room.
[00:32:21] Speaker A: I was gonna say, because she got them two by fours out and was like, we're gonna put this together.
[00:32:27] Speaker C: She's the Bob Vila. Tim Allen.
[00:32:30] Speaker A: I love it.
[00:32:31] Speaker C: You know, and sometimes, like. Like, that's too much horsepower. Can. We don't need that, you know, but I. I get it, but we don't need that. We don't tear something up. But. But the thing is, like, she built the podcast studio that I record out of and have always been very, you know, supportive and like. Like, I think you can do this, and I think you can turn this into a thing.
And, you know, and that's why I make it a point, like, when I go to get invited to, like, this speaking thing, that speaking thing, this award thing, this and the other, I always want my best girl on my hip with me. Because, like, the thing is. Is, like, what?
[00:33:07] Speaker A: The only girl?
[00:33:10] Speaker C: Well, I mean, I do have daughters, so it's like, I mean, true.
[00:33:13] Speaker D: All right, fair enough.
[00:33:15] Speaker C: Daughters. So. But the thing is, is, like, I want her right there with me because she was very much part of that success, so she should have some of those spoils as well. And so I try to make it a point, like, even when we went to Los Angeles for the ambies and we got all dolled up and suited and booted and walked the red carpet and stuff like that, I want her to make sure she has all those experiences because she's been part of that process since the beginning.
[00:33:40] Speaker D: It's also, like, it was really easy to support podcasting, but because by the time it came along, we had already started the business. And when I first had this idea to do something that was kind of, you know, nutty, it's like, hey, I think I. I called him one day, I was like, I think I want to quit my job and I'm going to do this thing. And he's like, immediately. And this is a lot given, you know, everything I said about, like, you know, how he normally, you know, tools, you know, said everything figured out. He's like, you know what? I don't. I don't know what this is, but I know you. And if you say we can do it, you know, I'm all in. And so it's like that kind of supports, like, okay, a lot of pressure now. We have to be successful.
But also, by the time, you know, part of my Work is paying attention to future trends. So when I heard about podcasts, and I was like, oh, this is going to be a thing. And it's. It's, you know, a little before it became a thing. So I'm like, yeah, you know, I read. I read in the. I read. So I'm reading a line, and I think this is going to be like the new media. And so you should think about that, because unfortunately, and this is me saying this as an English teacher, people don't really like to read.
I think this is probably your best. Your best bet. That and the fact I know he'd be good at it. You know, he does, you know, great research. You know, I love his work ethic. I'm in awe of his work ethic because I. I'll say I'm. I'm. I'll accept a word like visionary. I. I think I'm better. More. I'm more of an architect personality, but I'm definitely not. Like, I don't have, like, excellent work ethic. Like, he does. She does.
[00:35:15] Speaker C: She does.
[00:35:17] Speaker A: But it's a good. That's a good combination because you have the visionary and then you have the. The executor, and that seems to fit well for both of y'all. So did you guys, like, have regular jobs and then you're like, I'm gonna do podcasting and then just quit?
[00:35:34] Speaker D: Well, so we started the company first, and then.
[00:35:38] Speaker A: Okay.
[00:35:39] Speaker D: Part of the business, I think I always thought of it as, you know, pretty much getting an MBA as we were building this business. Right. And so that was the first podcast, the Startup Life, which is sort of just like, naturally a product of us trying to figure out this thing. And even if, you know, we're both great researchers and that sort of thing, there's a lot of these conversations that happen in other communities that don't happen in our community. So what if we could, you know, make it hip hop, make it engaging and that sort of thing. And then some of these secrets of millionaires and billionaires, you know, they sort just. They're out there for everybody, including us, you know, while we're building this business.
I think after that, he just fell in love with it, and that was something that was really, really good to see. I think when you love somebody, you want to see that spark, like, you know, light up in their eyes if it has nothing to do with you. And you're just like, okay, great. I. I love that. I love that for us. Right? And. And so it's like, I don't Think we both wholesale.
I'm still having trouble sort of accepting the label of a podcaster because, you know, even when he started, it was more so like, you know, I have this background, I guess, not in editing, but I was an English teacher. So it's like, hey, you know, maybe this doesn't quite match the tone here, this, you know, notes and that sort of thing. But he's, you know, he's in the closet. You know, he talks about. I built the studio, but literally, it was just like, I'm gonna create this space for you, you know, so that you're comfortable and that sort of thing. So wherever, you know, get in and. And fit in, I'm the type. I'm going to jump in. So.
So that was. That was cool. When I decided to do podcasting, it was more of.
If you listen to some of the stories in the B word, you understand the background that I'm coming from and the fact that I lost my parents, you know, when I was really, you know, when I was really young. My father when I was five and my mother when I was 13. And so there's. There's always been, I think, like, this. This secret pressure of mine to, you know, sort of outlive that so that, you know, to try to stay healthy, try to, you know, try to be there for my daughter as she's going through these tough times that I had to navigate, you know, without a mother. And so part of the B word was, you know, if anything did happen to me, I want my daughter, when she's old enough to, you know, really understand some of these circumstances, to go and at least, you know, understand who I am and how I navigated challenges and, you know, maybe do that. So I don't know even then, if I thought of it as a podcast or thought of myself as a podcaster. It was more about, you know, this sort of open letter, this diary, you know, these. That I knew, you know, even if there was a house fire, this record.
[00:38:25] Speaker A: Of it, right, that say that it's almost therapeutic because Nick B. I was telling you about it. I was listening to one of the episodes, and she was talking about the addiction to the struggle.
It was like one of your earlier podcasts, and you had a guest, and she was talking about the dynamics of struggling and how we always feel like we have to overcome something as women to our success and our achievements. And when I tell you that hit, I was like, oh, so do you feel like that for you, like you're saying you're not really a podcaster but is it more of like, like you said, like your diary, like you're telling your testimony. It's therapeutic for you to tell your story.
[00:39:05] Speaker D: I think in the beginning I was, I'm just. So the work that I do with Dominic, it makes sense for me. I'm introverted, you know, sort of just like heavily introverted and conscientious. So it's, I'm comfortable behind the mic and behind the scenes, sort of, you know, mechanizing and kind of pulling levers and, you know, figuring out what this does. And like a puppet master, not a, you know, have a great connotation, but like parts where, you know, like it might have been strategic that my husband, like, you know, he'll come and he'll have these conversations with me. Those like, you know, 50 minute long conversation about like some business like kind of term or something. And I'm just like, yeah, you need an outlet fam. And so podcast, you know, he watches MSNBC or. No, what is it? It's not. Emma said, what is it with cnbc? Cnbc with all that. He was watching, watching it all the time. And I was like, okay, listen, you know, the business is making a little money. I, I think I, I think you'd be good at investing and you know, so I'm, I'm, I hope I'm good. And I, it's. So far my track record is pretty good at just, you know, I pay attention to people and I of course pay attention to my husband. And I'm just like, this is something I think that'll fulfill. It'll meet these goals and, you know, maybe we'll have some, you know, fun sort of doing it.
[00:40:23] Speaker B: So how do you guys do your research?
How do you guys do your research? Especially to be so informed on so many topics? Do you spend a lot of time reading the news together?
Articles? Like, where do you, where do you research?
[00:40:41] Speaker D: Well, I, I read everything. Like, I read everything I can't get my hands on. So usually it just works that way. Like he, he's a digital reader. I like books, mag, like fizz, like actual physical old school stuff. But he's like, you know, he'll know everything that's, you know, on social media and that sor. So we kind of just keep each other informed or. And like I said, we know each other, we know each other's interests. So it's like, hey Kenda, I saw this and I sent you an article that I think you'd be interested in. Hey Dominic, I sent you something. I think you Might like, you know, that sort of thing. So we. We both try to be well read and, you know, well rounded, so big believers about knowing at least a little bit about a lot of things. You know, it's. It helps. It comes in handy in some of those rooms and spaces and that sort of thing. But then we. We just, you know, if we find something each other is interested in, and we just. We go down a rabbit hole. And I think in both of our shows and both of our. Our ways of thinking about things, you can tell that we're like, We're. We're really comfortable. We like to get, you know, deep in the weeds and that sort of thing. So it's like, you could tell that with his stories. And then sometimes, you know, I'm listening to my guests, and that was one of the interesting things that I don't. I don't. I think I. I kept hearing, like, you know, there's narrative podcasts and then there's interview pod. In my head, I was like, I wonder if you could do an interview narrative podcast, like, cross the streams, as it were. And so the B word really has that structure where it's like, I get to research people, and that's. That's new for me. It's a challenge, and. Because I'm introverted, but I have a fascination with people. I like people, I love their stories. And yet it's always really difficult to start these conversations. And so now I have really great conversation starters. People that I don't know reach out to me. And it's been. It's. It's been a really, really, like, awesome experience just to kind of be pulled out of my shell because, like, sometimes when the episodes drop, you know, like I said, I started getting all these messages and some of the people are strangers and that sort of thing. And I know that, like, that used to make me really uncomfortable, but now it's like, oh, this is a way that I can engage with the world.
And so part of that is research, right? So I research people and obviously have that skill set of researching topics and ideas, so I can help with that and send them stuff. But he's just, like I said, he's just a machine. Like, if he's.
[00:43:08] Speaker A: I was gonna say, because for Dominic's podcast that you've expressed that it takes, like, months of research for one episode because they're really detailed.
[00:43:20] Speaker B: And see, we just bring subject matters for us. Tell us how you do it, right?
[00:43:25] Speaker A: We're just gonna sit here.
[00:43:27] Speaker C: I mean, I think you have to have a Love for the work. Right. I mean, I think it definitely starts there. Right? So like for me, it doesn't take nothing for me to go read the New York times from like 1899 so I can get little factoid out. Or like the Baltimore Rising sun from. Oh, the Baltimore African American from like 1977. Because I want to get this little detail in there because I think, because I know that my audience is going to appreciate that. And I always, I guess I'm addicted to that feeling. Like I never knew that and like people to, to say that. So it's, it's definitely a labor of love, is definitely intoxicating, but. But it's also a labor of love. And I always have to tell people. People like, listen, as long as it took me put that episode together, can you like slow it down? You just gobble it up for like 25 minutes. You like just like, just ease into it. Because one of the things I do is like, I'll make an episode, takes me like a month to do, and I'll send it to my mom because my mom loves black history and she'll like call me like an hour later. Oh, that was so good.
[00:44:32] Speaker D: Like you listen to it already.
Then I'll be like, yeah, twice. And it's like, oh, okay, listen, listen.
[00:44:39] Speaker A: Oh, you would hate me. I listen to the podcasts on like 1.5 to 2 point speed because I have to get through it fast because I can't wait.
I think I binged all of Yalls episodes like both podcasts in its entirety in like two days.
[00:44:59] Speaker C: And people wonder like, you know, so when's the next one? Or why you don't have more episodes?
[00:45:03] Speaker D: Immediate question.
[00:45:05] Speaker C: Like you realize how long it takes to make those things. Because the thing is, is like with those type of shows, especially the B word, where it has a combination of an interview and narrative.
[00:45:15] Speaker D: Yeah.
[00:45:16] Speaker C: Normally people who make shows like that is like a team of 12.
[00:45:20] Speaker D: And it is just us and a lot of technology, by the way. So it's like I get the same thing that, that again, that's been, it's been unnerving, like not to meet strangers, but for strangers to have expectations of me.
[00:45:34] Speaker A: Right.
[00:45:35] Speaker B: So you mentioned that you just, you, you do your own filming and production, right?
[00:45:41] Speaker C: Yes.
[00:45:42] Speaker B: You don't have a team. You. Are you guys self taught? Did you go to school for this? I mean, you've always had a passion for tech.
[00:45:49] Speaker C: No, the self taught. It's one of those things where it's like, you know, you know what you want. It to look like, you know, what, what you want it to sound like. So it's like we've always had a conversation where we can either spend money or spend time. And we decided to spend time, right. YouTube University.
Look at other people editing and, and stuff like that.
[00:46:11] Speaker D: And don't discount the, the. Just the power of figuring it out yourself.
[00:46:16] Speaker C: That's true.
[00:46:17] Speaker D: It was just, it's something that we learned in business. We read the Power of Broke.
Yeah, Damon John's book was really important. And so we just realized that, like, you know, especially in the beginning, from the times where, you know, there was no money, it's like, okay, well, the Power Broke says that, you know, we spend money or we can spend time and that, you know, we spend time learning and then we spend time failing and then figuring it out.
[00:46:42] Speaker A: Because sometimes you spend time getting sponsorships and money. Right?
[00:46:46] Speaker C: Sometimes I make audio engineers upset because like, oh man, where did you go? To audio engineers who like full sales. Like, like, I didn't go print off.
[00:46:57] Speaker A: This certificate from YouTube real fast, but.
[00:47:00] Speaker B: Google my certificate because, like, because I'll.
[00:47:03] Speaker C: See them at awards galas and stuff like that. Because like I've won like a best editing award or best sound sound design award.
[00:47:10] Speaker A: Yes, please run through your awards because what, 23, 28,000. How many?
[00:47:15] Speaker D: There's the trophy case to help you remember.
[00:47:17] Speaker C: There's 23 of them right now. There's 23 of them right now across, you know, mental health, business history, obviously, spiritual and personal growth, hopefully.
[00:47:30] Speaker D: Right, that's. That hasn't happened yet.
[00:47:33] Speaker C: But you know, but, but yeah, like, I'll talk to these guys. Like, they just assumed that I went to audio engineer school, but like now I'm pretty much just self taught, like, and just kind of figure stuff out. Like it's one of those things where it's like. And I think it was. I can't think of the guy's name right now. But he, he told him he talked to a film director. He said everything you know about shooting the film you can learn in like 15 minutes. Oh, like, it's really not as difficult as tedious. There's other things. Is that the other. But like just the bare bones, you learn that in 15 minutes. And so I kind of took that mindset into podcasting and people think I, you know, when he got a certificate for it or training, and I was like, no, I'm pretty much self taught, but I know what I want. Black is America to sound like. I know what I want the B word to sound like. So I just make that happen.
[00:48:20] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:48:20] Speaker A: Well, both are amazing podcasts and you definitely should check them out, especially if you like reading but want to do an audiobook. I guarantee you, you will fall in love with podcasts listening to theirs because they're both just amazing and dope.
[00:48:35] Speaker B: And that's right up my alley.
[00:48:36] Speaker A: It is. Where can people find you a. To listen to your podcast if they want to? Because you guys do a little bit of mentoring consulting too, as well as your education work that you do. So where can people find you?
[00:48:50] Speaker D: No, I don't have this feel ready. You can find me. I'm. I'm on Instagram and Facebook. Facebook. Best place probably to reach me if it's about business or, you know, work, is on LinkedIn.
That's. I mean, that's pretty much it for me.
[00:49:06] Speaker B: What's your handle?
[00:49:08] Speaker D: Oh, on. I am. Eat, teach, create.
[00:49:13] Speaker B: Eat, teach, create.
[00:49:15] Speaker D: Beautiful.
[00:49:16] Speaker C: Listen to the B word on Spotify Apple podcast.
[00:49:20] Speaker B: See, this is why he is your.
[00:49:22] Speaker D: Partner yet, a podcaster. I don't have the. I'm not ready yet.
[00:49:27] Speaker B: Yeah.
[00:49:30] Speaker A: And Dominic.
[00:49:31] Speaker C: Yeah, sure thing. You can catch me on. On IG at the Real Dominic Lawson.
You know, on IG and then same thing, LinkedIn, Dominic, first and last name. And you can listen to Black is America on all your major podcast platforms.
[00:49:44] Speaker A: And if they wanted to reach out to you about the out educations.
[00:49:52] Speaker C: LinkedIn or Al, you know, out, you know, askows llc.com and stuff like that. So. Yeah, but usually LinkedIn is probably best.
[00:50:00] Speaker A: Gotcha.
[00:50:01] Speaker D: Okay.
[00:50:01] Speaker A: Use that LinkedIn people.
[00:50:03] Speaker B: Exactly.
[00:50:04] Speaker A: Nick B. Where can they find you?
[00:50:05] Speaker B: Yes, so I can be found on all platforms of Dirty Roses podcast. May that be our website, our Facebook, our Instagram or our TikTok. And if you want to reach me specifically, I can be found on Instagram @nickbnickb and that is Nick with a K. Ms. Lee Laree. Where can we find you?
[00:50:25] Speaker A: Well, first of all, you can find us in this beautiful studio provided to us by the Poetic justice foundation here in Portland. They do a lot of work around creating wealth in the communities. The black community specifically. They do education, they do outreach around investing properties, making sure that the black community can invest back into the black community and break these generational curses around the wealth. So check them out. The PoeticJusticeFoundation.org read their mission, read everything that they got going on. You can donate because if you do that, we can keep using this space. Yes, but if you want to reach me individually, you can catch me at all social media platforms. Lilaree it's L E I G H L A R I E 30 rosespodcast.com you can leave us a review, some feedback, a voicemail. You can ask for advice, give us a crazy dating story.
[00:51:19] Speaker B: Donate.
[00:51:19] Speaker A: You know. Yeah, because this is expensive. Because unlike the law sins, we haven't figured out how to do this by ourselves.
So anyways, we love this conversation. We will be talking to y'all soon because you are unofficial mentors at this point.
[00:51:34] Speaker B: Thank you.
[00:51:35] Speaker A: No choice for that.
And we will talk to y'all soon.
[00:51:39] Speaker B: Yes.
[00:51:39] Speaker A: Thank you.
[00:51:40] Speaker B: Guess what, Rose buddies? We are thrilled to introduce our new sponsorship packages. Be sure to hit us
[email protected] to inquire how we can showcase your brand on our platforms.
